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- Joseph Smith said in plain English that Heavenly Father has a Father. Here is the quote from “Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith” page 373 (meeting of June 16, 1844), “I learned a testimony concerning Abraham, and he reasoned concerning the God of heaven. “In order to do that,” said he, “suppose we have two facts: that supposes another fact may exist—two men on the earth, one wiser than the other, would logically show that another who is wiser than the wisest may exist. Intelligences exist one above another, so that there is no end to them.” If Abraham reasoned thus—If Jesus Christ was the Son of God, and John discovered that God the Father of Jesus Christ had a Father, you may suppose that He had a Father also. Where was there ever a son without a father? And where was there ever a father without first being a son? Whenever did a tree or anything spring into existence without a progenitor? And everything comes in this way. Paul says that which is earthly is in the likeness of that which is heavenly, hence if Jesus had a Father, can we not believe that He had a Father also? I despise the idea of being scared to death at such a doctrine, for the Bible is full of it. I want you to pay particular attention to what I am saying. Jesus said that the Father wrought precisely in the same way as His Father had done before Him. As the Father had done before? He laid down His life, and took it up the same as His Father had done before. He did as He was sent, to lay down His life and take it up again; and then was committed unto Him the keys. I know it is good reasoning.”
2. Rev. 1:6, “And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.”
3. Others like Brigham Young and Joseph Fielding Smith have also taught this doctrine. President Joseph Fielding Smith said, “Our Father in Heaven, according to the Prophet, had a Father, and since there has been a condition of this kind through all eternity, each Father had a Father.” (Doctrines of Salvation, Bookcraft, 1955, vol 2, pg. 47) Brigham Young explained that “there never was a time when there were not Gods and worlds and when men were not passing through the same ordeals that we are now passing through.” (Deseret News, 16 Nov. 1859, page 290) see also Revelations 1:6.
4. Joseph Smith taught “God the Father is an exalted man, native of another planet, who has acquired his divine status through a death similar to that of human beings, the necessary way to divinization (cf. TPJS, pp. 345-346).”
5. Joseph Smith in the King Follet Sermon said, “God himself could not create himself.” (https://www.lds.org/ensign/1971/05/the-king-follett-sermon?lang=eng)
6. Joseph Smith in the King Follett Sermon said, “God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens! . . .These are incomprehensible ideas to some, but they are simple. It is the first principle of the Gospel to know for a certainty the Character of God, and to know that we may converse with him as one man converses with another.” [Teachings, 345]
7. Elohim is a title, not a personal name. “Ahman” is Heavenly Father’s personal name based on D&C 78:15, 20 and Elder Orson Pratt, is a name of the Father (JD 2:342). The Egyptians had fragments of gospel truth (from Noah, Abraham, Moses, and others) and variations of Ahman are featured as names of their chief deities.
8. BYU Magazine had an article “Hebrew School” where a leading LDS Biblical Hebrew scholar Donald Parry explained the Hebrew meanings of “Lord God” and their LDS implications of the power of God to create other Gods. Here is the quote: ““Lord God” in Hebrew is YHWH Elohim or Jehovah Elohim. The –im at the end of Elohim indicates a plural word (see also the Hebrew cherubim, seraphim, urim, and thummim). Elohim literally means “gods.” Some non-LDS biblical scholars maintain that Jehovah originates from the Hebrew “to be” verb (but a causative form); thus Jehovah Elohim, some scholars assert, may be translated “He will cause to be Elohim,” meaning, “He will cause gods to be.” For Latter-day Saints, this literal translation of “Lord God” is significant because of our doctrine; the translation signifies that the Lord is a creator of gods or the idea that females and males in mortality can become like God in eternity. “Lord God” is found hundreds of times in the Old Testament.” (https://magazine.byu.edu/article/hebrew-school/)
9. one LDS man said, ‘but the bible and Book of Mormon don’t say that Heavenly Father has a Father’. To this I responded that the bible and Book of Mormon don’t say a lot of things, we aren’t limited to those. I’m puzzled at how basic of an understanding this man had suggested, that we would somehow reject any revelations not in the standard works? This is as silly as a Christian who rejects the Book of Mormon on the grounds that it’s not the bible!
10. When Joseph Smith was asked ‘where did it begin’ he removed his ring on his finger and said its one ongoing circle with no beginning and no end
11. Since ‘as man is god once was and as god is man may become’, how could have Heavenly Father gone through that without a father? There’s no such thing as a person without parents. Even Adam and Eve had parents, and were transported here from another earth as stated by Brigham Young. President Kimball said the rib taken from Adam to make Eve “is of course figurative”
12. Jesus Christ is the prototype of how to become like Heavenly Father. Heavenly Father (and now Jesus Christ) is (are) the prototype of an exalted man. All of Christendom and heathendom rack their brains over the great mystery of God, confused at who how what where and why is God, but let Mormonism bring the simple truth of eternity to your ears: God is an exalted man. He like us was in initiate in the ways of truth, and now, having proved himself a just candidate, has advanced to the status of God.
13. As far as we are concerned, Heavenly Father is Lord of all. 1 Cor. 8:5-6 reads “5 For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.”
14. One argument often used by people to refute the doctrine of Heavenly Father having a Father is that they claim Heavenly Father made everything. Hear this from Joseph Smith in the King Follet sermon, where he illustrates that the intelligence of man is as eternal as God himself, that God did not create it: “I have another subject to dwell upon, which is calculated to exalt man; but it is impossible for me to say much on this subject. I shall therefore just touch upon it, for time will not permit me to say all. It is associated with the subject of the resurrection of the dead—namely, the soul—the mind of man —the immortal spirit. Where did it come from? All learned men and doctors of divinity say that God created it in the beginning; but it is not so: the very idea lessens man in my estimation. I do not believe the doctrine; I know better. Hear it, all ye ends of the world; for God has told me so; and if you don’t believe me, it will not make the truth without effect. I will make a man appear a fool before I get through; if he does not believe it. I am going to tell of things more noble. We say that God Himself is a self-existing being. Who told you so? It is correct enough; but how did it get into your heads? Who told you that man did not exist in like manner upon the same principles? Man does exist upon the same principles. God made a tabernacle and put a spirit into it, and it became a living soul. (Refers to the Bible.) How does it read in the Hebrew? It does not say in the Hebrew that God created the spirit of man. It says, “God made man out of the earth and put into him Adam’s spirit, and so became a living body.” The mind or the intelligence which man possesses is co-equal [co-eternal] with God himself. I know that my testimony is true”
15. D&C 123:19-22 explains how mortals can become like God, which suggests the reciprocal of God attaining his status from where we are. “And again, verily I say unto you, if a man marry a wife by my word, which is my law, and by the new and everlasting covenant, . . .Ye shall come forth in the first resurrection; . . . and shall inherit thrones, kingdoms, principalities, and powers, dominions, . . . and they shall pass by the angels, and the gods, which are set there, to their exaltation and glory in all things, as hath been sealed upon their heads, which glory shall be a fulness and a continuation of the seeds forever and ever. Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from everlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, and the angels are subject unto them. Verily, verily, I say unto you, except ye abide my law ye cannot attain to this glory. For strait is the gate, and narrow the way that leadeth unto the exaltation and continuation of the lives, and few there be that find it, because ye receive me not in the world neither do ye know me.”
16. Abraham 4 from the Pearl of Great Price says the Gods, not the God, created: “1 And then the Lord said: Let us go down. And they went down at the beginning, and they, that is the Gods, organized and formed the heavens and the earth. 2 And the earth, after it was formed, was empty and desolate, because they had not formed anything but the earth; and darkness reigned upon the face of the deep, and the Spirit of the Gods was brooding upon the face of the waters. 3 And they (the Gods) said: Let there be light; and there was light. 4 And they (the Gods) comprehended the light, for it was bright; and they divided the light, or caused it to be divided, from the darkness. 5 And the Gods called the light Day, and the darkness they called Night. And it came to pass that from the evening until morning they called night; and from the morning until the evening they called day; and this was the first, or the beginning, of that which they called day and night. 6 And the Gods also said: Let there be an expanse in the midst of the waters, and it shall divide the waters from the waters. 7 And the Gods ordered the expanse…” AND SO FORTH.
Added Points and Commentary:
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To one comment questioning the usefulness of this research, I said “It is noteworthy, as cited in my document above, that JS plainly taught that Heavenly Father has a Father. I don’t think JS was wasting his breath! But yes, this doctrine isn’t as critical as the doctrine of JC offering us salvation. The HF has a Father doctrine does however help the saints understand the broad plan of salvation, and give them courage to press through difficult trials. Philippians 3:14 may be suggesting that the title “God” is a calling, and even one we should seek: “I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.””
2. A good comment on the article from one Stephen Douglas:
“Joseph was correct in saying, if God created man from absolutely nothing, not giving our eternal intelligence (psyche) a premortal spirit (pneuma) and then a physical body (soma), all three components mentioned in 1 Thessalonians 5:23, then we are nothing special, nothing more than biological toys created in a whim, which God apparently did after all past eternity of having done nothing. And, because He purposely created us to be so flawed we could not function, perfectly, having created us with innate certain fallibility, He then had to sacrifice His only real Son to save those few select biological toys He didn’t need to create, just so He could have said toys sit at His feet to sing Kumbaya to Him, for the REST of eternity.” - “President Young said There never was any world created & Peopled Nor ever would be but what would be redeemed by the shedding of the blood of the Savior of the world. If we are Ever Exalted and Crowned in the presence of God we shall become Saviors of a world which we shall create & people. I know why the Blood of Jesus was shed. I know why the blood of Joseph, & Hiram & others was shed and the blood of theirs will be shed. It is all to answer a purpose and has its Effect. Adam made this world and Suffered himself to take a body and subject himself to sin that Redemption & Exaltation might come to a man. Without descending below all things we Cannot ascend above all things. There never will be any Change in the gospel of Salvation, It is an Eternal gospel and the same in all worlds and always will be to the Endless age of eternity. There will never was a period but what worlds existed & never will be, they all have the same Gospel & Law of salvation.” -Wilford Woodruff, Waiting For the World’s End, The Dairies of Wilford Woodruff, Edited by Susan Staker, Pg.290
4. After men have got their exaltations and their crowns – have become Gods, even the sons of God – are made Kings of kings and Lords of lords, they have the power
then of propagating their species in spirit; and that is the first of their operations with regard to organizing a world. Power is then given to them to organize the elements, and then commence the organization of tabernacles. How can they do it? Have they to go to that earth? Yes, an Adam will have to go there, and he cannot do without Eve; he must have Eve to commence the work of generation, and they will go into the garden, and continue to eat and drink of the fruits of the corporeal world, until this grosser matter is diffused sufficiently through their celestial bodies to enable them, according to the established laws, to produce mortal tabernacles for their spiritual children.
[Brigham Young Brigham Young, August 28, 1852 JoD 6:275:4]
5. One Michael Doane commented on this article, asking where did it all begin? My response, “Joseph Smith took his ring from his finger and said it is one eternal round. Things with beginnings must have an end. There is no beginning, and no end. Also remember the doctrine that our spirits are co-eternal with God, God was advanced before us and ‘instituted laws’ to help us advance like himself. It’s in the Pearl of Great Price. Suggesting there has to be a first eventually means there has to be a last, which isn’t the case. BY and other modern prophets have taught that every person has a father, including every God…Yep it’s confusing. Something fun to chew on is that JS and later BR McConkie in his ‘7 Deadly Heresies’ sermon said that God has been in his station for 2.5 billion years. Have you ever read the book ‘the Kolob theorem’? it suggests a God at the helm of each galaxy, etc. (see my notes on that text elsewhere). Our song ‘if you could hie to Kolob’ presents this same mystery, where did it all begin? in that hymn it goes on to say ‘there is no beginning and end’ if I’m’ not mistaken. Trying to figure this stuff out is good clean fun isn’t it?
6. One person suggested the Adam God theory, that Adam is Christ’s Father, and Elohim is essentially Christ’s grandfather. I refute this theory. Here is my response, “ the temple actually refutes that theory… prophets taught HF lived on a different world than this one… since we’re not allowed to publicly discuss temple narratives, I’ll not argue this point any further. Are you somehow suggesting that Jehovah was working with his grandfather to instruct his father? Fathers teach sons, sons don’t teach fathers!… As for the Adam God theory, this has been denounced by modern prophets. For instance “We warn you against the dissemination of doctrines which are not according to the Scriptures and which are alleged to have been taught by some of the General Authorities of past generations. Such, for instance, is the Adam-God theory. We denounce that theory and hope that everyone will be cautioned against this and other kinds of false doctrine.” —Spencer W. Kimball, “Our Own Liahona,” Ensign (November 1976), 77 There’s plenty more where that came from, take a look at fairmormon.org on the subject. https://www.fairmormon.org/…/Repudiated…/Adam-God_theory I am active LDS and sustain the modern prophets’ teachings when there is any contradiction with past prophets’ teachings, particularly when such is taught repeatedly in our day opposing a doctrine taught in isolation in the past. JS taught to stay with the majority of the 12 apostles and you won’t be led astray.”
7. One questioned my sources in this document, but ToPJS, JofD, D&C, these are all good sources.
8. One Doug Hale commented on this article a useful idea along with a good quote from Brigham Young, “Why is it important to know that Christ’s Father was also the Savior of his world? Let’s first consider this: Matthew 5:48 48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. ————-Before the Atonement, only The Father was perfect. 3 Nephi 12:48 48 Therefore I would that ye should be perfect even as I, or your Father who is in heaven is perfect. ————After the Atonement, both The Father and The Son are perfect. So if it is the Atonement that perfected Christ’s Father and Christ, what perfects us? The same thing: “President Young said There never was any world created & Peopled Nor ever would be but what would be redeemed by the shedding of the blood of the Savior of the world. If we are Ever Exalted and Crowned in the presence of God we shall become Saviors of a world which we shall create & people. I know why the Blood of Jesus was shed. I know why the blood of Joseph, & Hiram & others was shed and the blood of theirs will be shed. It is all to answer a purpose and has its Effect. Adam made this world and Suffered himself to take a body and subject himself to sin that Redemption & Exaltation might come to a man. Without descending below all things we Cannot ascend above all things. There never will be any Change in the gospel of Salvation, It is an Eternal gospel and the same in all worlds and always will be to the Endless age of eternity. There will never was a period but what worlds existed & never will be, they all have the same Gospel & Law of salvation.” -Wilford Woodruff, Waiting For the World’s End, The Dairies of Wilford Woodruff, Edited by Susan Staker, Pg.290 . It is the Eternal Pattern, the way it has always been done and always will be done. There was never a Father that was not first a Son.” - Let us prove that some people have already become God’s. Here is D&C 132:29, 37: “29 Abraham received all things, whatsoever he received, by revelation and commandment, by my word, saith the Lord, and hath entered into his exaltation and sitteth upon his throne. 37 Abraham received concubines, and they bore him children; and it was accounted unto him for righteousness, because they were given unto him, and he abode in my law; as Isaac also and Jacob did none other things than that which they were commanded; and because they did none other things than that which they were commanded, they have entered into their exaltation, according to the promises, and sit upon thrones, and are not angels but are gods.”
- Some say LDS are bad since they think they can become Gods and say Lucifer fell for that reason. No, Lucifer fell because he tried to kick God out and take his place. Lucifer tried to become a God without really putting in the work to attain that status. In essence, he wanted to take someone else’s kingdom rather than building his own, which is a lot of work and self-sacrifice. Elder Christofferson had a brilliant presentation on this topic in a BYU Christmas devotional in 2017. I have a key portion of that lecture in my article ‘The Need for a Savior: God’s Plan of Justice vs Lucifer’s Tyranny.
