Pre-Existence by Ogden Kraut – Book Highlights

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This is a series of 3 books:
Pre existence, paradise, resurrection

The reason for the unequal and unfair conditions on Earth is the pre-existence

Who did sin this man or his parents – this question shows a man could sin before he is born

I proceeded forth and came from God said Jesus, and he said before Abraham was I am

The knowledge Jesus had before coming to Earth was taken from him, this was very humiliating (note – part of the condescension of God (1 Ne. 11))

The one third fallen angels are clearly spirits not resurrected beings who fell
Jude says these are fallen Angels who kept not their first estate
It also says they are reserved in chains of darkness until their judgment which means they did not live on a prior world, they are waiting judgment on this one

The council in heaven took place after the earth was formed because the losers of the war were cast out to Earth as spirits
And the devil was there in Eden

Michael was in charge of the armies of heaven and Joseph thought this is Adam so Michael would not have left his station to be Adam until the war was over so we know the war was over before Adam came to Earth

There must have been sin in the pre-existence because the Lamb was slain from before the foundation of the world

(note – this is an interesting debate. Some say no sin in pre-mortality, because there’s no sin in heaven. We do see though that people were taking sides. There was obviously greater and lesser amounts of valiance. I do say pre-mortality was in heaven, in the celestial kingdom where God raised us from his knee (at the MTC in 2011 Elder Holland told us God raised us from his knee in pre-mortality). Some say pre-mortality wasn’t in heaven because there was sin. I say it was there. God spends his time parenting, and he spends his time in his home. Naturally, many had to leave heaven when it got to a certain point, they were cast out.)

Christ suffered in spirit for the sins of the spirits and suffered and body for the sins of those in the body

(note – this applies to the above idea for sin in the pre-mortal spirit world. It is debatable but interesting. It implies Christ did a spiritual atonement over there for spirits)

We know there was knowledge of good and evil in the pre-existence because one third of the Angels got kicked out for being evil

Life on this Earth is a state of Innocence, it is another probation (note – called the 2nd estate) and that is why we forgot all before coming here so we can have this fair test

Man exists on the same principles of God, and that is eternal, in other words, self-existing

Jesus was shown his pre-mortal life as evidenced by his prayer to bring him the glory that he had with him before the world was

(note – it seems Jesus figured out pretty quickly his pre-mortal identity and life’s mission. He was teaching in the temple at age 12, and needed not that anyone should teach him.)

The knowledge that we lived before this Earth with God indicates that we’re going back home to familiar people, we’re not just going to meet God

(note – this is a motif of many legends and scriptures: starting out at home / in the promised land, going on a journey, then returning. This supports the idea that we lived in heaven before coming to earth, as in we lived in the celestial kingdom.)

Everybody believes in an immaterial heaven and that we popped out of nowhere to exist here but the Latter-Day saints know better and we’re the only ones who do

There’s about 20 children born every second

The prophet Joseph Smith taught that we have no beginning and no end, and this is where he used the ring analogy, that it’s a continuous circle

Spirits are anxious to obtain a body and they’d rather take a chance of going in a lowly body and a lowly circumstance than to risk not getting a body at all

Knowing of our life before and the life to come and the gift that this life is, the Latter-Day Saints should be the happiest of all people

There was the condescension of God but there’s also the condescension of man. We came by the Fall, we condescended to come here too.

Before Abraham was I am – this refers to Jesus being the firstborn of the spirit

(Note – apparently Adam came from something higher than this life because it was said that he fell)

The scripture says God hath anointed thee above thy fellows – referring to the preordination of Christ, this shows there were others there as well

Scripture speaks of returning to God, indicating we were there before

Scripture calls Jesus the elder brother and the firstborn

Scripture says that in his humiliation, his judgment was taken away. This is speaking of Christ, of the memory that he had before coming here, of the power he had to make worlds

Jesus grew in wisdom and knowledge because he had forgotten when he came here. We all forgot

God created and then it says there was not a man left to build the Earth; this is evidence as well as in the Joseph Smith translation of the Bible that the creation account was of the spiritual creation up to that point. This confuses the Christian world and they think it’s an error in the Bible when it talks about it there

Man was on earth before animal (as multiple scriptures in the D&C etc. attest)

Animals have spirits. But they aren’t the offspring of God. The spirits look like what the body looks like. The body conforms to the spirit.

The seventh day was not all rest, much of creation took place then

You cannot remember the first 6 months of life, yet exist we did

There’s no such place as beyond time and space. All is tangible and real. Heaven is a place.

(note – A planet, in fact this one will become a heaven, and God the Father lives on his home planet, and Christ will rule as God of this planet under the direction of the Father.)

Every person who comes to Earth has the opportunity to merit salvation

God can see the future but people still have their agency to choose

We cry repentance and strive to save souls because it is still hanging in the balance, it’s not yet determined

These days there are sheep herders who make all kinds of noises and yells to get their sheep to do things, but back in the day there were shepherds and the sheep would follow the shepherd and easily know his voice

How would his sheep know his voice if they had not heard it in the pre-existence?

Joseph feeling Smith taught there are two reasons we have the veil and do not remember our prior existence. First is because it gives us full access to agency. Second is because it motivates us to stay on this Earth until our work is finished, because if we remember the wondrous place we came from we would probably feel quite miserable here

It is suggested that various races and religions and countries into which we are born are determined by valence in the life before. Many leaders taught this

(note – I like to point out the possibility also of people choosing to fill missions among certain peoples etc. which could also influence where and how someone is born.)

Those who are valiant for God are spread throughout time and throughout the world so there can be leadership

(note – which supports the point I was making above, that living among various people’s and places can be mission calls to serve)

Orson Pratt spoke of how we come here without wisdom and knowledge and we are tested to see if we will pay attention to the little bit we get, and if we do obey that we get more. But the things we get in this life are still far inferior to the knowledge wisdom law etc. in a life to come

(note – I wonder if the veil was the mind forgetting and not so much the heart, that the path we take reflects our heart…)

About min 353 it starts the Mosiah Hancock journal vision, here are some highlights of it:

It takes the power of the Holy Ghost to tell apart the Father and the Son, they look so much alike

He saw God on his throne and God’s wives by him

People were created mates, they were in pairs of male and female, but many men went to perdition so they arranged plural marriage (no women went to perdition) (hint: it’s called “sons” of perdition)

In pre-mortal classes they learned arts sciences etc. everything to make them happy

Some became more proficient than others and were advanced from class to class

People like Joseph Brigham etc. were teaching

The Great Eternal is what they call God there

Jesus volunteered to go down to set the example of humility and patience

Lucifer appeared to be a chief military officer and when his plan was kindly rejected he didn’t stop advocating it and he eventually came out in open rebellion

Lucifer’s plan was called “the rights of the second”

The wicked gathered around Lucifer and the righteous gather around the Father and the Son and one called Michael said we will have this contest

(Note – this indicates Michael as a separate being from the father)

Those on the side of the Lord took the white star and those on the side of Lucifer took the red star

(note the similarity to symbols of red communists)

Some of them would not take a side, they wouldn’t take either star

(note – you’ll see eventually they did, ultimately all who came to earth did take a side, as prophets have indicated)

No females went with Lucifer

Those who took no place in the contest would keep their females and be a race of servants

(note – this is a hard teaching, but thankfully we now afford great blessings to all races)

The one third who went with Lucifer were all males and their females were given to those who stayed with the Lord as a second wife

The ranks were now of the followers of God having two females per male

There were classes, teachers, questions, etc.  Some of the teachers asked the people if they were willing to live the higher laws of God, meaning plural marriage. Sometimes they would respond by saying no, they just wanted to enjoy themselves. When asked if they would join the Church of God some would say no, they just wanted to be an officer or a judge or some other trade. They were asked if they would sustain the laws of God and of all mankind, and in every instance the answer was yes (note – naturally the answer was yes among those who weren’t perdition)

Some males even in heaven would neglect their females. They would go off not worrying about their duties

The Lord told woman taught by Joseph together around him to increase his posterity on the earth, and they did form a ring around Joseph and pledged to find him on Earth. Others like Brigham, John Taylor and other less notable men also had circles of sisters around them, and the Savior would enter the circle and perform rites.

The neglected daughters were all accounted for by plural marriage

He saw Abraham return from his probation to be crowned and exalted

When the time comes for mortal probation, one is set apart by the laying on of hands.
Then they dive down to the Earth like lightning.

Our associates volunteer to be our family.

He was told that he would have to go down to life and be misunderstood even by his brethren

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